Jan 31st, 2010 by Greg England
Many years ago, I was having a discussion with Virgil, an older member of the church where I preached, and he was trying to think of the name of a church on Fiske Blvd. in Florida. I was of no help and when he said, “You know … Jesus was one of them,” it just confused me even more because we all know Jesus was the founding father of the churches of Christ!
He was trying to think of the Nazarene church.
I mention that because one of the last places I ever thought I would visit for worship would be a Nazarene church. Having grown up on a rather steady diet of sermons denouncing every one but “us” and denouncing a lot of congregations who were supposed to be “us,” I never gave much thought to any other family of faith except “ours.” Long Beach helped me to see the Kingdom of God is far greater than the boundaries we have set.
Sunday we went over to visit with our daughter, Jessica, to celebrate her 25th birthday. She has been attending the Montrose Church over in Los Angeles County, somewhere near Burbank. It is a vibrant, growing community church that began as a Nazarene church. Interestingly, a church of Christ near by went through a lot of problems a few years ago and many of their former members now attend the Montrose Church.
It meets in a small facility … seats maybe 200 … so they have five services each weekend to handle the membership of nearly 1,000. Twenty-two years ago they were a dying group of about 30 older members.
The sermon was very good. Thought-provoking. An approach to the parable of the sower that I’d never heard nor given any thought. The people were very friendly and obviously love the Lord deeply.
The praise band was made of geezers and a few younger singers, but they were very talented geezers! The guitarist is as good as anyone I’ve ever heard, including our own Sal Hamby whom I think is very gifted of God.
I talked with their preacher for a while after everyone else got their chance to speak to him and felt as if I’d been a friend of his for quite some time. To be honest, when Jessica told me she was attending a Nazarene church, I had some concerns. Now that I’ve been there and I’ve seen a bit of the heart of their preacher and his love for the Lord, I am glad she is there. She is learning. Growing. Being challenged. Thinking. Praising. And most of all, being ushered closer to the Lord.
It’s not the church I grew up in. It’s not the church she grew up in. But it’s where the Lord has her at this point in her life and it’s not all that different from where He has me at this time in my life.
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Greg England
More than anything else, each time you give us a glimpse of your faith-journey I am struck by your genuine enthusiasm for the Lord and for the body of Christ. It is so refreshing. Thank you for sharing!
This is a very neat church. I listen to Pastor Dave’s message on their web site.
http://montrosechurch.org
Very user friendly web site.
Not hard to see how this church has grown. It’s interesting how our kids have found/are finding their way here. Whitney attends a very large Community Baptist church and Kelsey goes to the Oceanside Church of Christ which is very small.
Peace.
So what was the unusual viewpoint about the parable? Curious minds want to know.
Thank the Lord the Kingdom is so much bigger and healthier than we ever give Him credit for. I’m glad Jess has found a good place to worship with other disciples. When so many younger people are questioning whether or not they believe at all it is good to see a young woman find a spiritual home.
What Mommynator said! I’m interested, too!
Hallelujah! I’m glad she is at a church that is vibrant, growing and based on the central truths. And I know it helps her to know that you are in support of her choice because you’ve been there and experienced it for yourself. Good for you Greg! It meant so much to me through the years that my mom always supported me wherever I ended up as long as it was a place that truly worshiped and loved God and His truth. You’re a great Dad. The support we now receive from Long Beach and Los Altos is so very meaningful to me. I’m so glad you were a part of Long Beach for so many years. That is a place where people are allowed to grow and I’m thankful!! (Grow spiritually I mean–though the potlucks and valentine’s bake-off and all the other foodie events also helped us to GROW.)
Praise the Lord! I am so happy that Jessica is growing in her service to the Lord in a place where she can feel the love of God and Jesus.
What a joy to see our children unblinded and unbound from the chains that kept us captive for so long…..so cool.
Ditto what everyone else said. Including what you said about the different take on Jesus’ parable, Greg. I’d like to hear it, as well.
Dee
My heart aches…
I don’t normally post (however, I am a terrific lurker) and then seldom with my own name but I need to share my feelings, so I hope you will bear with the personal comment. I do believe that my ‘tribe’, as Patrick Mead says to describe our flavor of the Church, has so much to offer and is so worthy of loyalty and effort to draw closer to being the Bride of Christ. But I have been through so much of what Greg and all his readers seem to have been through in finding our tribe more concerned with what sets us apart rather than what binds us together. And today my heart is aching again…
There are two things that compel me to write. First, I have a daughter who has become involved in a relationship with another woman. She says that she attends a church. I think mostly because it is a church that welcomes and accepts the homosexual lifestyle as a part of God’s love. When I wrote a former minister at a university church for some help with understanding how to reach out to my daughter, I never received a response. It was as if the topic was too controversial to touch (I am receptive to Bible study that would show me if I am wrong about homosexuality being a sin but I have not found it yet). Why does the purported Church of Christ not seem to be able to stand up and identify sin and find ways to reach the sinner? It is SO MUCH MORE IMPORTANT that my daughter be in a relationship with Christ that compels her (as it must all of us) to walk in the light and give up our sins than it is for us to avoid the tough discussions about how to reach someone who would rather give up her relationship with her parents (no, we are not withdrawing from her) because of the love she has for her ‘mate’. Rather, our tribe seems to either avoid the discussion or just condemn the sinner (unless they ‘come forward’) and we move on…
Second, I was ‘corrected’ by an Elder yesterday morning. My wife and I knew that we were attending a conservative ‘tribe’ when we moved to our local community three years ago but we accepting of that and have made good friends with only the occasional frustration about “church of Christ ‘ism”. Yesterday I was the song leader. We typically use a video project during the sermon and yesterday I put the Doxology on the projector so we could sing the second and third verses that were not in our songbook. I then followed with scripture quotations during the next two songs just to reinforce the theme of the song. After service I was strongly admonished that “we do not do that here.” Now the good news is that there was a reason. It seems that another congregation had split some years ago and the remnant that came to worship with them felt strongly that the use of the projector during song service was the first step in what led to the split. I will not be a divisive member and will be in subjection to those members. The bad news of course is that using a projector during the song service is such a red herring. It is not just my heart that aches, it is my spirit. I need God, I need to worship God because he is worthy… because I am not and need his grace. As I said earlier, why, oh why, do we focus on what sets us apart rather than what binds us together?
I love my tribe. But I want to love God more. I am encouraged by the journey Greg has shared and the stories of his readers. I also rejoice that Greg and his daughter are in places to grow closer to God.
I’m still working on it. Blessings to you all.
Oh, my goodness . . . John – I shall pray with you and for you in all of these things you have shared with all of us today. I SO hope (and believe he will) Greg emails you to respond to your anguished requests for understanding and camaraderie.
Greg & I both (and many of us) follow Patrick “religiously” and consider him to be our friend, as well as each other. You might want to, if you have not already, write to Patrick, as well.
I pray right now that God’s grace, mercy and love lift you up in your trials and tribulations. Living where I do, I understand your struggles to the utmost. I have never experienced what you are at the moment with your daughter, but have family “destruction” occurring at the moment. We will all be here for you, John.
Dee Andrews
Dear brother John, a thousand thoughts are racing through my mind. Please know that I am praying with you and for you.
John – my husband’s brother has a daughter who has probably been there, done that and with many people and both sexes. She’s had two children as a result. She is so messed up. However her four siblings are “normal”, leading decent lives with good spouses, etc. You never know how things will turn out.
She was raised by very conservative, Calvinist-to-the-extreme (at least to me) parents who really loved her and tried to give her boundaries, etc. We always thought they went overboard on some things, but they did love their kids.
If you believe you contributed to her going for that lifestyle, then making peace with her is good. The rest is her choice for whatever reasons. Keep praying for her, show her love even if she knows that you don’t agree with her. God has His ways even when we see no hope.
I was directed here by my father, John, who’s comment is above. The purpose of this post is not to start any drama or explain myself and my choices. I understand all too well the perspective of most CoC individuals on this matter.
However, my partner and I would like to thoughtfully respond to Mommynator’s comment regarding her comparison to her husband’s brother’s daughter. I will not comment on Mommynator’s evaluation of her, as I don’t know her personally. Besides, whatever struggles she has in her life, “we are all sinners” etc..
However, I will say that both my life and my partner’s life and experience much more closely resemble her four “normal” siblings than the example given in comparison with us. We have normal, everyday, productive lives that resemble not at all the stereotypes you see on tv. We were each other’s first and only.
This comment is simply to provide food for thought, and because I have spent too much of my life being silent. Posted with all the respect and love in the world for my father, who I care for very much.
Brother John, I am you tribe, I feel your pain, and we are not left alone; He is with us. Together, we move forward and by His grace will be give Him glory by our efforts to help the fellowship grow in the likeness (and humbleness) of Christ. I remain quite no longer and pray to speak with His words…
John 2
Dear Rebecca:
That you chose a life that breaks your father’s heart says a lot. Please note that I left the door open for your Dad to re-evaluate your relationship and upbringing.
In your heart of hearts, you cannot ignore what Scripture – the basis of everything we learn, say, do and believe – rejects your “lifestyle”. This is not to say that I wouldn’t want you as neighbors, or that you are evil people who will steal my passowrds and wreck my life.
There is much more to be said about my niece, but in the end she chose her life and is living with the dire consequences of those choices. Things may be “cool” right now with your choices, but things have a way of catching up with ALL OF US when we make choices in direct contradiction to how God made us to be, and what we actually do.
God made us male and female to reflect His WHOLE character, as we are made in His image. You cannot decide that He doesn’t know what he’s doing when He says that you are hurting YOURSELF and your partner by doing otherwise. There may be reasons, but that’s still no excuse. People get the urge to do all sorts of things, but that doesn’t mean one should act on them.
And of course, there is much more to be said on both sides, but there’s the summary.